Sunday, July 10, 2011

See, This Is Why People Hate Vegans

I hate passive aggression, so I love passiveaggressivenotes.com. It's been one of my favorite time-wasting sites for years now. My friend Linda sent me a link to this recent installment, in which a self-righteous vegan leaves her omnivorous roommate a (not so passive aggressive) note, making ridiculous impositions. In case you can't make it through the whole thing, here are a couple quotations:

"I can no longer tolerate seeing meat, eggs, dairy, honey, or any other products from animals in our kitchen or anywhere else in the apartment. Do you understand?"

"You could at the very least eat these things away from me, like when you're out of the house. You could have done it in your room. That second suggestion isn't an option anymore, though, since I told you I will not allow these types of food anywhere in the house."

Photo: passiveaggressivenotes.com
Photo: passiveaggressivenotes.com
As a vegan, I am embarrassed by things like this. I understand the note writer's disgust toward being around animal products, and I even understand where her outrage comes from. But her attitude demonstrates why a lot of people think vegans are intolerant (and intolerable). I almost wish this note hadn't been posted on passiveaggressivenotes.com because it represents vegans so poorly.

The appalled reactions in the comments section reflect the damage done. One commenter writes, "She's obviously a zealot. There's no reasoning with them." Them? Crap.

I don't want people to hate vegans. I want people to love vegans and I want them to want to be vegan. So please, the next time you're going to write a crazed, intolerant letter to your omnivorous roommate, stop yourself and leave a note that says, "I made some extra tabouli for you. It's in the fridge. Help yourself!" instead.

32 comments:

  1. I love meat, I love tabouli. I love vegans. It's all good! :o)

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  2. I love meat. I love (almost all) veggies. I could NEVER switch over to a vegan diet though. Maybe it is just better if everyone learns that everyone is different but that doesn't mean you should wish other people to change. Our differences make us all special, unless we are mean to people, or try to force people to conform to what we think is right. That is not cool at all.

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  3. I saw the note on PassiveAgressiveNotes and it really annoyed me. I can't stand people who try to force their beliefs on other people.

    I'm a vegetarian and I try to limit the use of dairy and eggs and whatever else in my own cooking and I live in a household that eats red meat nearly every night. We get along perfectly fine. I can't stand people like the person who wrote the note. I'm sick of having people tell me how annoying vegetarians/vegans are. I'm not annoying about my diet and I take it as a personal insult when I am lumped into this "annoying vegetarian/vegan" category.

    Yeah...not too sure where my point is going but I wanted to say something. :)

    Amy.

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  4. Great response! My husband isn't vegan, but I have been for over a decade.
    I don't write him notes, and I never have. Thanks for finding my tweet @VeganTriangle about it!

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  5. Hi! I followed your link from passiveagressivenotes.com.

    about the comment about zealots, maybe she meant there's just no reasoning with zealots . zealots give every group they're associated with a bad name. one can be passionate about an issue and not shove it down everyone's throat.

    The vegan in the letter is clearly going about it the wrong way. I have a friend who is a vegetarian. she is passionate about the reasons she avoids most animal products. she shares information without being pushy or crazy about it. about 7 months ago i decided to give up meat for a couple of reasons but mainly to just eat healthier. The more i think about it though, the more troubled i feel by the whole "meats" industry anyway. it IS reprehensible the way animals are treated. there are SO MANY problems that have risen from the industry it sickens me. but i had to come to dealing with these issues on my own for myself. (most people don't like having ANY ideology shoved down their throats.) i LOVED having a friend i could turn to for more information, and recipes, and new ways of eating. it's is awesome to have someone to talk to and learn from. that letter writer is doing nothing for the cause and making the situation worse. She lost an opportunity to teach. it's like she's in it for the anger. it's just all angst.

    but you know what? most of us who think for ourselves know that 1 zealot is not representative of the movement, just representative of the zealots. :)

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  6. Andromeda: Good point! I do hope that commenter meant all zealots in general, not all vegans.

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  7. I came here from your comment on PAN. I did read that other comment as "Zealots can't be reasoned with", not vegans.

    I think this letter-writer's mistake was thinking her problem was her roommate's problem. It wasn't as if a previous agreement was broken. What's more passive-agressive than "I've been dropping hints that you haven't been acting on"! Non-communicative roommates are going to let things build to an outburst no matter the issue.

    But I'm sorry, I've tried your extra tabouleh, your hummus, your tofu, your Boca Burgers, your Tofutti Cuties, your soy milk, it just isn't gonna happen! I admire you, I'm sympathetic to your views. I have greatly reduced my meat intake, but I think I've gone as far as I can go. I do feel guilty about it. I always tried to be considerate when I stayed with vegetarians and hid what little contraband I had in a sealed Tupperware-type container, but I think living with a vegan would make it hard to be considerate enough, I would feel too offensive to them. It's not an ideal living arrangement. Everyone should feel "free to be me" in their own home as much as possible. Thanks for being tolerant, most of us that aren't totally insensitive don't at all enjoy grossing you out and upsetting you.

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  8. This reminds me of a lecture on how not to proselytize atheism entitled "Don't Be a Dick".

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  9. well said! as an omnivore (ex-vegan... long story) it's disheartening to see vegetarians and vegans act like this.

    like a commenter above mentioned, it seems to be less about their lifestyle and more about using it as a blunt instrument with which to beat people about the head with it (and acting smugly superior.)

    vegetarianism and veganism is about a personal life choice regarding one's diet and lifestyle (some may argue it's a moral choice but morals are fluid and can be vastly different from one person to the next.) that being said, i respect that you have a "to each their own" philosophy about it. though i'm sure you'd give the "speech" if the conversation lent itself to it (i say the "speech" in quotes because a lot of people when it comes to talking about it tend to have a fairly well-rehearsed dialogue about it) i'm glad to see that you aren't going to be a prick/douche about your lifestyle choices.

    though, all that over with, i have to admit, my time as a vegan DID increase my culinary skills... and i've cooked completely vegan meals by choice for omnivore friends and they positively loved it (i probably eat meat once every few days... not that i avoid it, more for practicality since when i do a big batch of veggie spaghetti or other meals, they tend to last quite a few days... waste not want not, eh?)

    p.s. did you know that you can fool some omnivores into thinking the "meat" in your spaghetti is meat when it's actually chopped up, dehydrated mushrooms? the taste isn't on par but the texture is pretty darn close.

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  10. This is a great message you gave here. Although people treat others badly when they have hate issues with themselves. There is a simple rule about how people get along with others. "Misery loves company."

    So a person with a lot of self hate can become a vegan. Then they will treat others badly. Remember that Adolf Hitler was a vegetarian. There is a saying from Insight seminars-- "Take care of yourself so you can take care of others." So take care of yourself.

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  11. Actually, the same could be said for your article over at Good. I really dislike the tone, and while it's definitely less intolerant and militant than this note, you still come off sounding like a whiny vegan. The world has enough of those, too. It's your right to whine, but please think again before post it in such a large public forum. I believe it's damaging to the good vegans out there.

    By the way, "deal breaker"? I understand that maybe it was on the tip of your boyfriend's tongue, but seriously--way to close people's minds before they ever even meet a vegan.

    www.good.is/post/dating-and-diet-can-a-meat-eater-and-a-vegan-be-happy-together/

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  12. Shannon: I really try to be the opposite of an intolerant, militant vegan, and speak out against passive aggressive notes like this one. If you read to the end of my article on GOOD, you'll see that my boyfriend and I both try our best to be tolerant of each others' eating choices.

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  13. The reasons vary for why people choose vegan. Here are two short videos to help everyone understand why so many are making this life-altering choice: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fKr4HZ7ukSE and http://www.veganvideo.org

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  14. I will vouch for the "here's some food" bit. That's the only time my carnivore roomies could have a meal minus meat. Most just don't know HOW to reduce the meat and stay full.

    I love my ex-roomies. Except for the one who left a passive agressive note herself. She can take a long walk off a short pier.

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  15. Never seen your site before this post, but I followed Shannon's link to your article on Good and I strongly disagree with her assessment of the tone. It wasn't whiny in the least and I'm sure many people have the same issue. I'm lucky enough to be married to someone who is also vegan, but it can definitely be awkward eating out with non-vegan friends. You don't want to limit their options, but then again you also don't want to end up in a restaurant where you have to pay $15 for a salad with oil and vinegar, or worse yet have no options at all!

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  16. Go vegan
    And don't put up with the unnecessary slaughter of animals.
    At every importunity, express yourself to those around you.
    Their very lives depend upon you saying something.
    Just as you would to racist, to sexist, or to any unjustifiable cruelty. Say something.

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  17. Chuck Bluestein
    Author Robert Payne, in his biography of Hitler, The Life and Death of Adolph Hitler (Praeger, 1973) theorizes that the image of Hitler as a vegetarian ascetic was deliberately fostered by propaganda minster Joseph Goebbels:
    "Hitler's asceticism played an important part in the image he projected over Germany. According to the widely believed legend he neither smoked nor drank, nor did he eat meat or have anything to do with women. Only the first was true. He drank beer and diluted wine frequently, had a special fondness for Bavarian sausages and kept a mistress....His asceticism was a fiction invented by Goebbels to emphasize his total dedication, his self-control, the distance that separated him from other men....In fact, he was remarkably self-indulgent and possessed none of the instincts of the ascetic. His cook, an enormously fat man named Willy Kannenberg, produced exquisite meals and acted as court jester. Although Hitler had no fondness for meat except in the form of sausages and never ate fish, he enjoyed caviar...."

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  18. I'd like to hear the animals who are tortured and slaughtered weigh in on this argument. I see the reasons to respect others' rights but they're infringing upon the lives of some friends of mine.

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  19. Anonymous: I know where you're coming from. Sometimes I just feel like showing this video http://www.mercyforanimals.org/ohdairy/ in the face of people and scream: YOU are responsible for this, this is YOUR money at work! But the fact is that the world doesn't change like that. We are still a minority and a message that ooze of anger will likely backfire and get people into defensive mode. The reality of the torture and death of animals that meat eating just won't get through when they're in that mode. This was one of the hardest things for me to cope with after going vegan and recognizing that animals welfare and lives matter too, for their own sakes. Are we supposed to play nice while this death machine keeps going at maximum speed? Are we to smile and get along with those funding the torture? Well, we have to, if that is what will in the long run shut the machine down.

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  20. Meghan, I totally agree! Judgment from vegans was what *kept* me from going vegan for years. Then I turned right around and started judging people, when I finally made the change. It's taken me years to get to a better place - and now I find my advocacy is much more effective. It's true what they say - "You can bring a horse to water, but you can't make him drink." So I really relate... thank you for this post.

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  21. Let's not let an assholic vegan distract us from an honest look at the central issue. Eating meat, eggs and milk causes others to suffer and die for our pleasure. We can each choose not to cause that suffering and death, which seems like a decent thing to do.

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  22. I thought the "them" in that comment referred to zealots and not vegans?

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  23. When I was in college I shared a house with a roommate with many problems. He did teach me one good thing. Even the best note is not a good way to communicate. If there is way for the reader of the note to take it the wrong way, they will. Notes erode goodwill and cooperation among roommates.

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  24. Since roommates are involved there is a good chance that author of the note was a college student or a woman in her early 20s......an age where many Americans are still not completely grown up.

    Maybe the unhelpful content of the note is more about the immaturity of the author and less about her trying to eat a cruelty free, environmentally sound diet

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  25. Really??? This note may have been irritating, but to have caused this much hate mail??

    I guess human nature never changes. It goes like this: “You criticize me for doing something, even something cruel and indefensible like delighting in the death of innocent animals, and I'll show you, yes I will, by escalating my cruel behavior and shoving dead carcasses in your face.”

    The number of callous, vengeful responses to this letter on passiveagressivenotes.com is truly frightening – a veritable angry mob just itching to dismember and roast the vegan herself.

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  26. While everybody knows passive aggressive notes are rarely effective and usually have the opposite effect, for some of us, seeing corpses in our own home is highly traumatic. If my roommate wanted to rape women in the house, I'd ask them to stop that too. Why does Vegan Outreach make it a mission to bash veganism? It's absurd.

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  27. I just think people are way too sensitive and quick to jump onto others' cases. Can't we all just get along??? We vegans should be working together for the common good of animals, the environment and ourselves. It's such an enlightening lifestyle and I have become so much more optimistic because of it. Let's have that reflect on everything we do. Granted, I get upset over mean, ignorant comments too, but I try not to let it get to me. And shame on those who judge a whole group of people by a small number of peoples' actions!

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  28. Omnivores need to get a clue, Their diet creates unecessary victims. This vegan made a huge mistake trying to live with an omni, she shouldn't have even tried. The abolitionists spoke out against slavery, its time a lot of vegans got a backbone and are vocal about their beliefs.

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  29. Wow. So many of you have a truly enlightened mind on cooperation. I applaud you for that. It amazes me however those of you that think your arbitrary line making on your eating habits excludes you from causing death.

    If you shop at any supermarket, or purchase any products derived from plants you cause death. If ANY harvesting equipment is used millions of insects and thousands of crops die each time. Not to mention if pesticides are used, even organic ones. So what gives you the right to draw the line at animals and why do you have the audacity to imagine omnivores don't have the right to hold a different view?

    And by the way comparing eating animals to raping? Are you that desperate for something with impact?

    Why aren't all of us just putting aside our differences and working together to take on factory farms and leave the ecologically and humane Animal husbandry farms alone until we get rid of the corporate monsters that destroy our planet in the way they raise all food and mistreat employees?

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  30. I have to say, I biased towards vegans. It stems from my super passive-aggressive roommate, who, coincidentally is a vegan. She wasn't bad when we moved in until I started drinking soy milk (I development a lactose intolerant). She became relentless about how her veganism makes her morally, physically, spiritual, etc, etc, better then me and everyone else. She is also an insufferable twat as a human being and seems to think she's the queen of our apartment. I know that some people are simply closed minded and annoying as sin, regardless of their diet, religion, race or any other factors. Some people just suck.

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  31. Bless you, doll! I consider myself vegan but apparently the Vegan Police (including non-vegan Vegan Police, the most annoying kind) would argue that I'm not because I have P&G cleaning products in my house. Meat in the fridge (for my husband), too. I guess my husband is just so awesome that he makes up for the stomach-turningness of having meat in my house ;)

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  32. The problem I have with most vegans is they fail to realize they have made a CHOICE and that choice puts them in the vast minority in America. The world and society will not bend to your preferences, so you have do deal with the reprecussions of your choice and that is living in a meat eating world.

    My brother stops by my house and wonders why we don't have any vegan snacks...because I am not a vegan. When you come over for dinner I am going to make meat, chicken, fish, etc...if you don't like it bring something for yourself. When I come over to your house, knowing its a vegan household and I am now in the minority, I would not demand meat be cooked.

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